Post by Dance Away on Apr 20, 2009 8:51:15 GMT -5
The last time I underwent a psych exam was about 10 years ago (happened sometime between '99 and '01 - can't remember exactly when).
The pychologist asked me this question:
What does the phrase "a rolling stone gathers no moss" mean?
I gave a 'concrete' answer knowing that this phrase was ancient, and that it had more meaning to it than just the 'concrete' answer I gave. In the absense in my mind of not knowing exactly what that abstract meaning was, I gave a 'concrete' answer.
Today, I'm just discovering why this question of the meaning of "a rolling stone gathers no moss" was asked of me in a psych exam 10 years ago.
This is reinforcing my perception that there are serious ethical problems occuring in diagnostic practices in our mental health system.
My last office visit with a mental health counselor occured in 2001.
I will never again volutarily set foot into the office of a mental health counselor in my lifetime.
--Aaron Vose (SpaceMonkey)
The pychologist asked me this question:
What does the phrase "a rolling stone gathers no moss" mean?
A rolling stone gathers no moss / in psychiatry - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_rolling_stone_gathers_no_moss#In_Psychiatry
In Psychiatry
Because it is so well known, this saying is one of the most common proverbs used in psychological tests for mental illness, particularly schizophrenia, to look for difficulty with abstraction. American research conducted in the 1950’s between Air Force basic airmen and hospitalized Veterans Administration patients with schizophrenia found that the way a person interprets proverbs can be used to determine abstraction ability. The lack of abstraction ability in these studies was statistically significantly higher in the VA patients and it has thus been construed as indicating pathology. As persons with mental illness are generally believed to demonstrate 'concrete' thinking (a tendency to interpret abstract concepts literally) the research results have, in practice, often been improperly generalised to suggest proverbs alone can be a sufficient indicator of mental illness.
A 'concrete' interpretation of the proverb "a rolling stone gathers no moss" would simply restate the proverb in different words, rather than delivering any metaphorical meaning. For example, a 'concrete' interpretation of the proverb is of the kind "If you roll a stone down a hill, it won't pick up any moss". This kind of answer is considered a failure to abstract and fails the psychological test. An example of an abstract interpretation is when substitution of metaphors occurs. A "rolling stone" is interpreted as (eg) an unsettled person or a busy person and "moss" is interpreted as (eg) something to be avoided or conversely, something to be desired. The important feature of the test is the discernment and substitution of metaphors rather than a particularly 'correct' answer.
Critics of using proverbs this way point out that:'sane' persons who have never heard the proverb will interpret the proverb 'concretely'This method was used in One Flew Over the Cuckoo's Nest (film) (Forman, 1975) in order to interrogate McMurphy and to test his mental state. His answer was the following: "It's hard for something to grow on something that's moving"
proverbs are neither a necessary, nor sufficient test for mental illness;
while a negative (concrete) result indicates nothing, there is anecdotal evidence that negative results are incorrectly used to diagnose mental illness;
while a positive (abstract) result strongly indicates no mental illness, there is anecdotal evidence that positive results are frequently ignored.
I gave a 'concrete' answer knowing that this phrase was ancient, and that it had more meaning to it than just the 'concrete' answer I gave. In the absense in my mind of not knowing exactly what that abstract meaning was, I gave a 'concrete' answer.
Today, I'm just discovering why this question of the meaning of "a rolling stone gathers no moss" was asked of me in a psych exam 10 years ago.
This is reinforcing my perception that there are serious ethical problems occuring in diagnostic practices in our mental health system.
My last office visit with a mental health counselor occured in 2001.
I will never again volutarily set foot into the office of a mental health counselor in my lifetime.
--Aaron Vose (SpaceMonkey)